Bava Metzia 79

Chapter 79

א וכן אמר רבה השביחו לאמצע א"ל אביי מי דמי התם גדולים גבי קטנים ידעי וקא מחלי הכא מי ידע דליחיל
1 and thus did Rabbah rule likewise, They improve it for both equally.'<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Rashi, regarding this last phrase, 'and thus etc.', as a continuation of R. Hisda's statement, substitutes Rab for Rabbah; firstly, because Rabbah was R. Hisda's pupil, and he would not quote his pupil's views in support of his own; and secondly, because an Amora is never adduced in support of a Mishnah. But Rab was his teacher, and he is cited not in support of the Mishnah, but in explanation thereof; as there is a view that this Mishnah refers only to a natural improvement, he quoted Rab as holding that it refers even to improvements directly effected by the brothers. Tosaf. retains our reading, explaining that this is not a continuation of R. Hisda's speech, but an observation by the Talmudic redactor that Rab once gave a similar ruling. ');"><sup>1</sup></span>
ב אגלגל מלתא ומטא לקמיה דרבי אמי אמר להו גדולה מזו אמרו שמין להם כאריס השתא דידיה לא יהבינן ליה
2 Said Abaye to him:<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' [To Rabbah (according to Tosaf.).] ');"><sup>2</sup></span>
ג אהדרוה הא לקמיה דרב חסדא אמר להו מי דמי התם ברשות נחית הכא לאו ברשות נחית ועוד קטן הוא ואין מורידין קרוב לנכסי קטן
3 How compare? There the adults are aware of the [existence of the] minors, and forego [their labour on their behalf]; but here, was he [Mari] aware [of him], that he should forego! Now, the matter travelled about<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lit., 'the matter rolled on'. ');"><sup>3</sup></span>
ד אהדרוה לקמיה דרבי אמי אמר להו לא סיימוה קמי דקטן הוא:
4 until it reached R. Ammi. Said he to them [his disciples]: Even a greater thing has been said, [viz.,] A valuation is made for them as for an <i>aris</i>:<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' V. supra 39a, in reference to a next of kin who enters into a captive's estates; on the latter's return, the former is paid for his improvements as an aris, receiving a half, third or a quarter, in accordance with local usage, though, of course, the land was not his at all. ');"><sup>4</sup></span>
ה <big><strong>מתני׳</strong></big> המפקיד פירות אצל חבירו הרי זה יוציא לו חסרונות לחטים ולאורז תשעה חצאי קבין לכור לשעורין ולדוחן תשעה קבין לכור לכוסמין ולזרע פשתן שלש סאין לכור הכל לפי המדה והכל לפי הזמן
5 shall he then not be paid [likewise] in his own!<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Even if the claimant is entitled to half of the improvement, surely Mari is entitled to a fraction of that half, as though he were an aris! R. Hisda, however, had not allowed for this. ');"><sup>5</sup></span>
ו א"ר יוחנן בן נורי וכי מה אכפת להן לעכברין והלא אוכלות בין מהרבה ובין מקמעא אלא אינו יוציא לו חסרונות אלא לכור אחד בלבד רבי יהודה אומר אם היתה מדה מרובה אינו מוציא לו חסרונות מפני שמותירות:
6 This [observation] was brought back to R. Hisda. Said he to them: How compare? There [in the case of a captive's estates] he entered with authority [of the court]; here he entered without authority.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' On his father's death he took possession without a court order. ');"><sup>6</sup></span>
ז <big><strong>גמ׳</strong></big> אורז טובא חסר אמר רבה בר בר חנה א"ר יוחנן באורז קלוף שנו: לכוסמין ולזרע פשתן ג' סאין לכור (וכו'): א"ר יוחנן א"ר חייא זרע פשתן בגבעולין שנו תניא נמי הכי לכוסמין ולזרע פשתן בגבעולין ולאורז שאינו קלוף שלשה סאין לכור:
7 Moreover, he [the claimant] was a minor [when Mari first took possession], and a relative is not permitted to enter into a minor's estates. When this [reply] was taken back to R. Ammi, he said to them: They did not complete it [sc. the narrative of this lawsuit] before me [by informing me] that he was a minor.
ח הכל לפי המדה וכו': תנא כן לכל כור וכור וכן לכל שנה ושנה:
8 <b><i>MISHNAH</i></b>. IF A MAN ENTRUSTS PRODUCE TO HIS NEIGHBOUR, HE [THE BAILEE] MAY [WHEN RETURNING IT] MAKE A DEDUCTION FOR DECREASES [AS FOLLOWS]: FOR WHEAT AND RICE, NINE HALF <i>KABS</i> PER <i>KOR</i>;<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' 1 Kor = 30 se'ahs = 180 kabs. ');"><sup>7</sup></span>
ט א"ר יוחנן בן נורי וכו': תניא אמרו לו לרבי יוחנן הרבה אובדות מהן הרבה מתפזרות מהן
9 FOR BARLEY AND MILLET, NINE <i>KABS</i> PER <i>KOR</i>; FOR SPELT AND LINSEED, THREE SE'AHS PER <i>KOR</i>: ALL DEPENDS ON THE QUANTITY AND THE TIME.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., these pro rata decreases hold good whatever the quantity; also, they are dependent on the time the produce is stored — the Gemara states that these are per annum. ');"><sup>8</sup></span>
י תנא בד"א שעירבן עם פירותיו אבל יחד לו קרן זוית אומר לו הרי שלך לפניך
10 SAID R. JOHANAN B. NURI: WHAT DO THE MICE CARE; THEY EAT [THE SAME] WHETHER THE QUANTITY BE LARGE OR SMALL! HENCE HE MAY MAKE DEDUCTIONS ONLY FOR ONE <i>KOR</i>. R. JUDAH SAID: IF IT IS A LARGE QUANTITY HE CANNOT DEDUCT DECREASES AT ALL, BECAUSE IT INCREASES.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' This is discussed below. ');"><sup>9</sup></span>
יא וכי עירבן עם פירותיו מאי הוי ליחזי לדידיה כמה הויין במסתפק מהם
11 <b><i>GEMARA</i></b>. But rice decreases by much more! — Said Rabbah b. Bar Hanah in R. Johanan's name: This refers to peeled rice.
יב וליחזי כמה אסתפק דלא ידעי כמה אסתפק:
12 FOR SPELT AND LINSEED, THREE SE'AHS PER <i>KOR</i> etc. R. Johanan said in R. Hiyya's name: This refers to linseed in its calyxes.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Since they dry up and are blown away by the wind, the decrease is so large. But pure linseed does not suffer so great a loss. ');"><sup>10</sup></span>
יג ר"י אומר אם היתה וכו': כמה מדה מרובה אמר רבה בר בר חנה א"ר יוחנן עשרה כורין תניא נמי הכי כמה מדה מרובה עשרה כורין
13 It has been taught likewise: For spelt and linseed in its calyxes and unpeeled rice, three se'ahs per <i>kor</i>.
יד תני תנא קמיה דרב נחמן בד"א שמדד לו מתוך גורנו והחזיר לו מתוך גורנו אבל מדד לו מתוך גורנו והחזיר לו מתוך ביתו אינו יוציא לו חסרונות מפני שמותירות
14 ALL DEPENDS ON THE QUANTITY etc. A Tanna taught: It is thus per <i>kor</i> per annum.
טו א"ל וכי בשופטני עסקינן דיהבי בכיילא רבא ושקלי בכיילא זוטא דלמא בימות הגורן קאמרת בד"א שמדד לו בימות הגורן והחזיר לו בימות הגורן אבל מדד לו בימות הגורן והחזיר לו בימות הגשמים אינו יוציא לו חסרון מפני שמותירות
15 SAID R. JOHANAN B. NURI etc. It has been taught: They [the Sages] said to R. Johanan, Much of it deteriorates and much is scattered.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Besides the depredations of mice; therefore it does depend on quantity. ');"><sup>11</sup></span>
טז א"ל רב פפא לאביי א"כ לפקע כדא הוה עובדא ופקע כדא אבע"א משום איצצא:
16 A Tanna taught: This holds good only if he [the bailee] mixed it with his own produce. But if he assigned him a special corner he can say to him, 'Behold, here is yours before you.'<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Whatever the decrease. ');"><sup>12</sup></span>
יז <big><strong>מתני׳</strong></big> יוציא לו שתות ליין ר"י אומר חומש יוציא לו שלשה לוגין שמן למאה לוג ומחצה שמרים לוג ומחצה בלע אם היה שמן מזוקק אינו יוציא לו שמרים אם היו קנקנים ישנים אינו יוציא לו בלע ר"י אומר אף המוכר שמן מזוקק לחבירו כל ימות השנה הרי זה מקבל עליו לוג ומחצה שמרים למאה:
17 But what if he did mix it with his crops: let him see how much his own was!<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And knowing the combined quantity and by how much the whole has decreased, make a proportionate deduction. ');"><sup>13</sup></span>
יח <big><strong>גמ׳</strong></big> ולא פליגי מר כי אתריה ומר כי אתריה באתריה דמר חפו בקירא ולא מייץ טפי באתריה דמר חפו בכופרא ומייץ טפי איבעית אימא משום גרגישתא הא מייצא טפי והא לא מייצא טפי
18 — It refers to one who drew his supplies therefrom. Then let us see how much he drew? — He does not know.
יט באתריה דרב יהודה רמו ארבעים ותמני כוזי בדנא אזיל דנא בשיתא זוזי פריס רב יהודה שיתא שיתא בזוזא
19 R. JUDAH SAID: IF IT IS etc. What constitutes a LARGE QUANTITY? — Said Rabbah b. Bar Hanah in R. Johanan's name: Ten <i>kors</i>. It has been taught likewise: What constitutes a large quantity? Ten <i>kors</i>. A tanna recited before R. Nahman: When was this said? If he measured [the corn] for him out of the granary and returned [it] to him out of the granary. But if he measured [it] for him out of the granary and returned it to him out of the house, he may make no deduction for decreases, because it [the quantity] increases.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The measures used in the granary were larger than house measures, hence the same quantity shows a larger figure when measured by the latter; this increase counterbalances the normal decrease. ');"><sup>14</sup></span> Are we dealing with imbeciles, he retorted, who give with a large measure and take back with a small! Perhaps you mean the season of the granary.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., summer, when the corn is harvested into the granary. ');"><sup>15</sup></span> [Thus:] When is this said? If he measures it out to him at the harvest season and returns it to him in the harvest season. But if he measures it out to him at the harvest season and returns it to him in the rainy season [winter], he may make no deduction for decreases, because it increases.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' In winter the crops swell up, the resultant increase counterbalancing the normal loss. ');"><sup>16</sup></span> Said R. Papa to Abaye: If so, the barrel [containing produce] ought to burst! — It did once happen that the barrel [did in fact] burst. Alternatively, it [the reason that the barrel does not generally burst] is on account of the tightness [of the crops].<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Tightly pressed together in the barrel, they have no room to expand and cause it to burst. ');"><sup>17</sup></span> <b><i>MISHNAH</i></b>. HE MAY DEDUCT A SIXTH IN THE CASE OF WINE. R. JUDAH SAID: A FIFTH. HE MAY DEDUCT THREE LOGS OF OIL PER HUNDRED, WHICH IS A <i>LOG</i> AND A HALF FOR LEES, AND ONE AND A HALF FOR ABSORPTION.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' The barrels absorb that quantity. ');"><sup>18</sup></span> BUT IF IT WAS REFINED OIL, HE MAY MAKE NO DEDUCTION FOR LEES. IF THEY [THE CONTAINERS] WERE OLD BARRELS, HE MAY MAKE NO DEDUCTION FOR ABSORPTION.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Old barrels have already absorbed as much as they can contain. ');"><sup>19</sup></span> R. JUDAH SAID: EVEN IF HE SELLS REFINED OIL TO HIS NEIGHBOUR DURING THE WHOLE YEAR, THE LATTER MUST ACCEPT A <i>LOG</i> AND A HALF OF LEES PER CENT.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., if the vendor sells a quantity of oil but keeps it in his own barrels, supplying it in smaller quantities to the vendee as and when desired. Having received 98 1/2 logs of pure oil without sediment, the vendee must now accept 1 1/2 of lees. ');"><sup>20</sup></span> <b><i>GEMARA</i></b>. But there is no dispute; each master rules in accordance with his region. In the locality of the first master they covered [the inside of the wine barrels] with wax, so there was not much absorption;<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Not more than a sixth. ');"><sup>21</sup></span> whilst in that of the other [sc. R. Judah] they covered [them] with pitch; hence they absorbed more.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Sc. a fifth. ');"><sup>22</sup></span> Alternatively, it is on account of the clay [used in making the barrels]; the one quality absorbed more, the other less. In Rab Judah's locality forty-eight jugfuls went to the [standard] barrel, a barrel being sold at six <i>zuz</i>, and Rab Judah retailed six [jugfuls] per <i>zuz</i>.